Show Notes from Knup Sports Show

Show #211 – Chris Shreeve of Locker Room Labs

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On episode 211 I sat down with Chris Shreeve of Locker Room Labs. We talked about the future of sports betting businesses and how important it is to find the right tech team to build your projects.

In this episode of the New Sports Show, host Ryan Knuppel interviews Chris Shreeve, the founder of Locker Room Labs, a sports app development company. Shreeve discusses his career journey and how he transitioned from working in sales and marketing for the Seattle Mariners to founding his own digital advertising agency. He explains that Locker Room Labs focuses on building custom software for sports betting, fantasy, and iGaming brands, and highlights the company’s unique selling proposition of having a team of US-based engineers with experience in the sports industry. Shreeve also discusses the challenges of integrating innovative ideas into the sports technology space and emphasizes the importance of open-source integration. He concludes by sharing his vision for Locker Room Labs and his goal of being a top choice for companies looking to build sports technology.

Ryan Knuppel:

What’s up everybody? Good afternoon. My name’s Ryan Knuppel. Welcome to the New Sports Show, episode 211. We are up over 200. Really appreciate you spending some time listening to this show, watching this show. However you’re consuming this. Really appreciate that you could be anywhere doing anything and you chose to pay attention to this and learn a little bit about sports betting, iGaming sports business. Wherever we lead today, I have another amazing guest. I cannot wait to introduce him and what he’s doing in this space. But first off, hope you’re enjoying some football man. And we’re in what, after week two of the N F L. It’s been an amazing first couple weeks. Hopefully you’re enjoying that. I wanted to say I am heading out to G two E in Vegas in a couple weeks. Hope to connect with you all there. If you’re heading there, please reach out to me and let’s set up up a quick meeting, dinner, drink, whatever you want to do. Alright, without further ado, I’m going to bring on my guest today. Today I have Chris Shreve, sorry, Chris with Locker Room Labs. How are you today, Chris?

Chris Shreeve:

Good, Ryan. Thanks for having me.

Ryan Knuppel:

Yeah, I appreciate you being here and you’re one of those guys kind of like me. I see you everywhere. You’re on LinkedIn, you’re posting here, posting there. So I’m really excited to get to know you a little bit and feature what you’re doing. First off, where are you from, Chris, where are you living?

Chris Shreeve:

I’m out in Seattle on the west coast here.

Ryan Knuppel:

Nice, nice. How you like it? I’ve never been out there. I’m down in sunny Florida, but I need to get to the other end of the us. How is it?

Chris Shreeve:

All Seattle Lights are supposed to tell you that it’s rainy. Don’t move out here, don’t come here. But if I look outside, it’s 70 degrees and sunny. Can’t complain. Still golfing weather. So I’m all

Ryan Knuppel:

Good. Love it, love it, love it, love it. Awesome. Well let’s dive in here, Chris. I’m excited to learn about Locker Room Labs, but first off, let’s learn a little bit about you. Tell us a bit about your career journey, your career path that led you to where you’re today with Locker Room Labs.

Chris Shreeve:

Yeah, I mean, sports has always been in my blood, decided to go to college for business. But a funny kind of story, I saw a coach that had been recruiting me for baseball who ended up being the head coach at my school. He saw me at the gym and he goes, what are you doing, Chris? Why aren’t you playing baseball? I said, well, I was planning on coming here five 11, right-hander that throws a low eighties, wasn’t going to cut it. So I ended up walking on the team and hurt my back maybe a couple months after I kind of signed the letter. It was a sign that maybe I should focus on my business career. And to be honest, I I’m glad that it happened that way. I was fortunate to have a lot of great connections in the Seattle market out here, particularly in sports, and I got my dream job with the Seattle Mariners right out of college.

I was able to be in sales and marketing, be on the microphone, introducing a new sponsorship or dancing on the dugout. That might’ve not been my favorite thing in the world to do, but nonetheless, it was a great experience. But really technology had always kind of called me into that space. And being out in Seattle with all of the great technology here, I decided to really focus on the marketing and advertising technology side of things for a good portion of my career. But was fortunate to be able to work with a lot of sports organizations, sports sponsors and brands in and around the sports space to keep my hand in the industry. And about eight years ago, I founded a digital advertising agency. We offered paid media services and solutions to all sorts of different companies and over time we grew it scaled, it completely bootstrapped a service-based company.

So really had to grind and claw to drive customers, increase revenue without any funding, without any outside investment. But that experience really showed me what it was like to build a profitable company, to do it on your own and to create a great service that was sticky and to not be able to rely on other investment, really having to build something from the ground up. I was fortunate enough to build that into a 1215 person agency, did seven figures in sales and was able to have a personal exit of that agency at the end of last year. So that brings us to today and all the exciting things that we’re doing with Locker Room Labs.

Ryan Knuppel:

That’s awesome. Congrats on that. I definitely know the grind it is to own an agency and congrats on doing it. I won’t say the right way, a lot of ways to do it, but doing it one way that works for you and it’s certainly rewarding at the end of the day when you’ve done it yourself. So congrats on that exit and that path. That’s amazing.

Chris Shreeve:

Yeah, I always say it really callouses you in business. To bootstrap something, you really have to find a product or service market fit. You can’t buy your way into revenue, you have to earn it. And while it’s a slower grind to build and grow and scale a business, it is fulfilling and rewarding. Certainly doesn’t hurt to bring on capital and especially on the technology side of things, you need it. But I was able to take a lot of those learnings over the last seven to eight years in the advertising world and really parlay that into locker room labs. The one thing on the marketing side of things that was so frustrating to me was having clients come to us with really horrible technology and really bad apps saying, Hey, marketing’s the silver bullet. If I spend a million dollars with you, you’re going to change the whole direction of my company. That’s not how it works. Marketing’s one piece of the puzzle. But I knew that there’s a challenge. There’s a challenge in building technology, building it effectively, efficiently scaling it. And while I’ve had all of this experience on the brand marketing and advertising side, I really wanted to get my hands dirty on the technology part of the whole ecosystem.

Ryan Knuppel:

Cool. So that really leads into locker Room labs and what you’re doing there. Obviously a lot of great experience leading into this. So you’re well prepared to, you’re well prepared for this venture, but why don’t you give us a high level overview of Locker Room Labs. I’m going to pull up the site alongside here so we can look along if there’s anybody watching. But yeah, feel free to give us the high level overview of what you guys are up to.

Chris Shreeve:

So when I looked into the sports world, I talked to a lot of great people that are in the industry and one thing kept coming up, there’s a ton of innovation in the space, but most people dunno how to execute it. They have great ideas and concepts of new betting, fantasy iGaming ideas, but bringing it to life was a little more challenging. So me having built an agency that provided B two B services, I thought this is a great foray into technology and I can bring that kind of agency development mindset, that user-centric kind of marketing approach to the technology side of things. So Locker Room Labs is a sports app development company that specifically focuses on building custom software for sports betting fantasy and iGaming brands. Some of our unique selling props is we’re all US-based engineers. Cool. And so when you talk about the nuances within sports and particularly sports betting space within the United States in particular, it’s really important I think to have service providers that understand the industry at a really deep level.

And so for us, we have a team of 25 full-time engineers who all have experience building technology within the sports betting fantasy and iGaming industry. They’ve built sports books free to play games, ai, ml, data science type tools for parlay recommendations. I mean you name it, right? And so really for us, we acknowledge that there’s two different routes that you can take as a business. When you’re looking to build an app, you can hire in-house, which is costly. You’re having to hire people to a startup. It’s competitive. You have to give up equity, you have to pay benefits, you have to not just bring on engineers, but product managers, people for qa, A C T O. If you’re a non-technical founder, that all starts to add up. So often when a company realizes, Hey, look, I can’t hire in-house right now, I have to go and outsource.

Most of the time you think of an overseas development shop, and a lot of the times you feel like from a cost perspective, you need to find someone overseas. Now, don’t get me wrong, there are a lot of great development teams overseas, but there’s just as many times and stories that we’ve heard from people of missing deadlines, not understanding the sport and not understanding what it is you’re building and who you’re building it for. So we really like to say that locker room lab sits in the middle of that decision. We’re a highly skilled US based group of senior engineers that really get sports and know how to build technology for this particular industry. We don’t come at the cost of hiring an entire team and staff in-house, but we provide better quality service and support than your stereotypical dev shop overseas.

Ryan Knuppel:

Man, I feel like I’m listening to myself when I pitch my content agency because I literally, I a hundred percent relate with you. We’re an all us company as well, and there is so much value to that, especially in the sports industry when you’re talking about dealing with North American sports and dealing with that, just that whole world, understanding how to talk and just live and breathe that world is so important, especially if you’re serving a business with your resources. Those resources need to understand what’s going on from more than just a technical side on your side. So I completely relate to your story and what’s going on. That’s awesome. Tell me a little bit about where you guys are at in the lifecycle. So you’re a fairly young company, but where are you guys at? How are things going in the beginning days here for you?

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Chris Shreeve:

Yeah, we we’re looking to shake things up a little bit. You mentioned you’ve seen me everywhere. I think what our goal is as a B two B service company is to lead with education information and thought leadership. When you think of a B two B service company, particularly a software development shop, you think of a website that looks like a SaaS product, super techie technical terms, and not a lot of brand awareness. Quite frankly, what you see with Locker Room labs is we can resonate with technical and non-technical founders in the space. So really what we’ve aimed to do is not push all of these technical services out there and try to overly aggressively sell. What we’ve tried to do is lead with content, start talking about the challenges that companies are facing and provide value to the industry through content, which I know you guys I’m sure preach all day every day.

But we wanted to take something really technical and be able to have it be digestible by anyone, a non-technical sports founder, all the way to the C T O of a tech company. So why we’ve been aggressively out there is because we do feel like there’s a little bit of white space. We feel like there’s an opportunity for somebody to come in to really change the way that people are thinking about that hiring, staffing or outsourcing decision when it comes to building sports technology. So everything that we are doing right now is focused on building a credible brand that leads with content and thought leadership. And in doing so, we feel like we’re going to spark up the conversation and let people know that, hey, there’s another alternative to the really difficult, risky decision of finding that right overseas partner and maybe the more costly decision to try to hire and staff an entire team.

And we’re coming out strong. We are trying to shake things up. We’re talking about technology in a very different way, and because of that, we’re having some really, really incredible conversations with anyone from a legacy Sportsbook operator to really unique, innovative data providers or suppliers all the way to really cool startups that deserve to have a great partner that can help them get past just building an M V P and ended up in the graveyard so many technology companies do. So we’re excited that the vision and the content and the messaging has been resonating and we’re super excited to get our hands on the technology and start building it for all these companies.

Ryan Knuppel:

That’s great. That’s amazing. Yeah, I’ve been blown away over the last few years doing what, over 200 episodes of this show we’ve had on some amazing companies doing some really innovative and awesome things, and every time somebody comes on with an idea or an app or something, I’m always like, man, that’s such a great idea. And then I start thinking about all the challenges in the tech behind it that has to happen. My question for you is I feel like I start feeling like all the innovation is done, everything’s been thought of. Are you still seeing innovative ideas come onto the table in the industry? Are you still seeing some cool new innovative ideas that you guys are able to work with companies on?

Chris Shreeve:

Yeah, I mean I’ve had in the last three months, probably 60 calls, mainly because I really want to invest my time in meeting people and getting to understand the space at a deeper level. I mean, look, we’re kind of an upstart new company, but the experiences that we have working with sports teams on the marketing side or our engineers who have built 15 plus sports apps in the space will speak for itself. But I’m having conversations with amazing founders who have great ideas. But the big hurdle right now is I believe that at the top of the technology ecosystem, you have these really huge companies they own and essentially operate all of the functionality for sports books. And those larger legacy companies are slower to move when it comes to innovation. And I would even say in some instances, not incentivized to even allow some innovation within their platform because it’s outside of their black box ecosystem.

So the thing that I keep hearing from so many companies is that they have these great ideas, but they don’t know how to integrate it. With these industry stalwarts, they run up into this big backlog where it’s like, Hey, we’ve got this great tool that your users want and need, but it might take 12, 18 months to get integrated if it’s even taken into consideration at all. So what I’d love to see happen in the space is a little bit more open source integration going on. I think that it would allow for all of these great startup companies who have incredible ideas for better user experience, better data to be able to bet on new leagues. We talk about pickleball all day every day, it seems like these days, but all of these new really cool ways to consume sports, to bet on sports, they’re there.

But there’s a disconnect between how we get those tools and those solutions into the hands of consumers in a scalable fashion because these startups can’t buy their way past the big players in the space. They have to do it in a scrappy manner organically. But my hope is that we can help these teams build really, really great tools that will speak for themselves, that’ll be really sticky and really engaging, and that over time more and more startups can innovate and the larger players in the space can adopt some of those technologies to make the user experience better for sports betters and fantasy players.

Ryan Knuppel:

I love it. Love it, love it. Chris Shreve of Locker Room Labs, Chris, Hey, what’s the future look like for you guys? I mean, obviously being a young company, you’re just looking to grow, but give us the six month future and the two year future. What’s the plan? What are you up to for the coming years here?

Chris Shreeve:

Yeah, I mean, I would say this next month is super important for everybody in the space leading up to G two E eight or those that are out in Barcelona. For us, what’s really, really exciting is we’re putting out about a 20 page ebook that’s going to be downloadable from our site. It’s going to have a ton of research and information about the hiring, staffing, and outsourcing process, a really objective and a thought leadership piece that we think will spark a lot of conversation. We’re also building really unique partnerships with data companies in the space like a sports data io to really try to bring better technology and scalable integration to teams. And then ultimately, I can talk the talk. We’ve got to walk the walk, right? We’ve got to prove that we know what we’re doing and we know that it’s going to take a leap of faith by some companies to say, Hey, look, we trust and believe that this is the right team through everything that they’ve been able to communicate to us and show us. But I mean, long-term, really simple for me, I want to be in the conversation when any company is looking to build technology and deciding whether or not they want to outsource it or keep it in-house. And I’d like to shift the decision from do I hire in-house to do I outsource overseas to do I hire in-house or do we hire locker room labs?

Ryan Knuppel:

Yeah, I love it. That’s a great mission to have. That’s amazing, Chris. I love that. So you mentioned G two E and Barcelona. You hadn’t personally are you hadn’t either one of those?

Chris Shreeve:

Wish I could go to Barcelona. It’s maybe my favorite city in the world. I’ll be at G two E, going to be going to Monday Night Football. My Seattle Kraken are playing the nights on Tuesday. I’ve got a really cool golf event with a bunch of really cool key stakeholders and decision makers within the space that I’ve just organically curated. So some really, really cool things that I’m trying to do to get into the mix and have some great conversations. And so like yourself, love to meet with anybody. We certainly need to meet in person when we get down there. But yeah, I think for me, I went to S B C in New York. I went to the Canadian Gaming Summit in Toronto all before we even launched the company. So we’re going to be super active at these events and show our commitment and investment in the space.

Ryan Knuppel:

Awesome. Yeah, I can’t wait to meet you in person there at g2. I wish I was going to Barcelona too. I’m having major fomo, but that’s part of it, I guess. Can’t make it all right. We can’t do it all.

Chris Shreeve:

Can’t do it all.

Ryan Knuppel:

Can’t do it all. Hey, what did I miss? Chris last words, any final thoughts? Anything that you wanted to touch on that we didn’t before I let you go?

Chris Shreeve:

No. If you’re a company out there that is looking to build a new app or you’re on a technology team right now that’s looking for additional resources to add to your existing team, reach out. Let’s chat and would love to work with any companies in the Space

Ryan Knuppel:

Locker. Room labs.com is the U R L. Hey, what’s the best way to get ahold of you? I’m pretty sure you’re going to say LinkedIn, but give it to the

Chris Shreeve:

Audience if I haven’t already reached out to you on LinkedIn to connect, which hopefully I already have. Make sure to connect follow locker room labs where we aggregate a lot of really good sports technology content and love to engage on LinkedIn and chat with you in person at G two E.

Ryan Knuppel:

Awesome, Chris. Well, I appreciate it. Hey, one last question I just thought of before I let you go. And I want to get your input on this, just being a tech guy and we’re doing some AI stuff in the content space. So I wanted to get your thoughts on the role AI is going to play and is it sticky? Is it here to stay? Is it going to continue to be part of this innovation that we see in gaming? What are you seeing in AI and what are you guys doing specifically from a development side and the AI side?

Chris Shreeve:

It’s the hot button topic right now. What I always say is that AI is everywhere in our world and we just maybe don’t really think about it or realize it, right? When you’re using Netflix, there’s data that’s being used to recommend that show that you can binge all day on Saturday, right? It’s on your phone when you’re on Google and you’re typing in a certain keyword or looking for something to reach, or in the marketing or advertising space when you go to a website but you don’t quite buy that pair of shoes, what do you start seeing all day every day? Of course that pair of shoes, AI is everywhere. I think it’s how we use AI in terms of things like chat, G B T or other tools that theoretically help in terms of efficiency completing projects. One thing I will say is that I think consumers will start to see if your content, so particularly on the marketing side of things, if your content is not authentic, if it’s generic, generalized, if you’re using AI on really important thought provoking pieces and it’s too generic and too generalized, consumers are going to see right through that and they’re not going to start to maintain that credibility with your content.

And so what I would say is right now I think AI is great from a efficiency standpoint to check things, to write prompts, but there needs to be a human touch on really, really complicated things like marketing and like technology. I think we’re a ways away before an app is going to be fully built with a prompt in chat GT four or if entire businesses are going to be completely built on the foundation of it. So I think man and the machine, a good combination of both is the right way to go right now.

Ryan Knuppel:

Not that you need it, but I support that answer a hundred percent. I love it. I love that answer. Thank you. I wanted to get your thoughts on the AI side of things. Chris, I’m going to let you go. I want to thank you for coming on the show and wish you the best of luck with Locker Room Labs. I think you’re doing some amazing things and can’t wait to see where you head over the next couple of years.

Chris Shreeve:

Thanks Ryan.

Ryan Knuppel:

Alright, have a good one. Yeah. Alright, that was Chris Shreve of Locker Room Labs. Chris seems like a great guy. I’m excited to meet him at G two E. I urge you to reach out to him on LinkedIn if you haven’t already, get something set up, just chat with him, especially if you have tech needs, any type of tech needs in this space, reach out to him. We all have our spots, we all have our niches. And what Chris is doing is really an important area, especially in the coming years. A very important area to any new project that’s starting up. So please reach out to him. That would be amazing. Reach out to me anytime. Of course, Ryan Knuppel at, at Ryan Nup on all the social medias. Again, I’ll be at G two E in October. I really look forward to seeing you. I’ll be at all the post events and all the things going on, so please just reach out or if you want to set up a 15, 30 minute meeting, I’m happy to do that as well. And we can sit down and talk about whatever you’re needing in this industry. Alright, that’s it. I’m checking out. Episode two 11 is complete. Talk to you all soon. Have a great day. Bye-bye.

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